I completely understand my GPA is very subpar and being from a non target doesnt help my case. Silicon Valley. The number of Analysts at BBs, EBs, and IBABs exceeds the number of spots at middle-market and larger PE funds each year and as a result, many of those Analysts wont even end up in PE. If you're new here, please click here to get my FREE 57-page investment banking recruiting guide - plus, get weekly updates so that you can break into investment banking. So here goes. We respect your privacy. What is your view between working at a BB outside of London (more specifically in Paris) vs. working at an IBAB such as RBC in London? Simply being able to write Investment Banking Associate or Analyst on your CV will get you more interviews at other firms once you accept it and have been working there for a while. I am at a non-target school in southern California with a 3.7 GPA, and an upcoming summer internship in a regional boutique investment bank in San Jose, California. Hi Brian, thank you so much for this post and continuing to answer everyones follow up questions! Even at the BB banks, a relatively low percentage (< 50%) get in. Would prefer Evercore, Lazard, or Greenhill and currently debating whether to hold out for a spot there. I have managed to however change my image and have been a model student for the past 2.5 years. Have seen some increase in the RX mandates at Jefferies recently. It means its running out of liquidity. Otherwise, youll be up against people with more relevant work experience and even some who worked in IB before. Ive interned at a big 4 firm last summer if that helps..problem is that I dont know if Ill get an interview without any networking over there. What do you think about the ranks for Japanese banks Nomura, Mizuho, and SMBC? One of the live deals didnt require I do much and the other one is very quiet. About the same. A top BB or EB is almost always a better bet. Barclays has better groups in terms of advisory, however, and they do M&A in-house so they get the edge for me". both offers be equal in this regard? Hard to say because so much depends on performance in a given year. Prior to joining Greenhill, Neil spent 17 years at Rothschild where he most recently served as Executive Vice Chairman and Co-Head of North American Debt Advisory and Restructuring. As always, amazing article. See the article on lateral hiring here. Thank you. A spokesperson for Rothschild says the bank has a protected weekend policy to, "allow colleagues to plan for events with full confidence that there will not be a last-minute breaking of commitments due to work." In France, this policy stipulates now work after 8pm on weekdays and no work at the weekends. Yes, I do (this article was written about a year ago, so not much has changed). You can still get into top business schools, but its harder and youll need something good outside of work. This is super helpful. Hi Brian, Sed cum voluptatem nisi modi. Most people who will be interviewing for PE jobs in 2 years will understand this difference. [WallStreetOasis.com]ste please do something about this. Yes, probably. Thank you! You can find thread upon thread about the exits for Lazard and Blackstone. send less people into PE than MM firms, not sure because of self-selection during recruitment or other factors. how big are the analyst classes of In Betweens? Non magnam blanditiis amet ea natus. Reiciendis sit fugiat quia a. I have a military background as I was a submarine officer for 6 years. I had a consulting internship in 2019 and my client was Coach. - Both Lazard and Rothschild have a reputation for paying less than larger rivals, and may need to offer sweeteners as big banks hike salaries. Discover How To Break Into Investment Banking, Hedge Funds or Private Equity, We respect your privacy. Millstein started recently but are on very big deals, and Evercore while strong reputationally, are still establishing themselves. I have a question and I wanted to hear your opinion If possible. I dont have any experience in the field. technique - and why do banks like it? I am currently a masters in finance student at a semi target graduating this spring with a 3.6 GPA and currently interning at a middle market PE shop. Thanks. I am an international student who started as an analyst 4 months ago. They dont necessarily focus on one industry, but they often focus on a small set of industries; they also tend to do mostly M&A deals and private placements. I would try maybe a 50% / 50% split between MMs and EB/BB banks. ^^ Not sure if DB is still considered a good brand name (or a BB) ? Thank you so much in advance. I am curious as to what groups at Lazard are typically the best bet in regard to exit opportunities at these firms. Its incredibly difficult to find information on that market because theyre all small countries, and so even more activity takes place in London instead. However, then I would have 5-6 months experience in this boutique firm and another 3-4 months experience at a bigger firm. Fuck it I'll bump them up, Technology boutiquerankings: not doing tiers but listing names, 2. See: https://mergersandinquisitions.com/investment-banking-masters-programs/. When I asked HR about it, they said the industry average of $10k was only available to their returning interns, and since I was a full time hire, I was only eligible for half of that. Do they hire the best and brightest? 100% staying within finance and not interested in corp dev type of exits. It seems like theres very little information on Hines, which raises questions in my mind. Also, my bank will likely to claw back my signing bonus. I am waiting on a potential offer from Evercore. It feels like the latter are making better headway in Europe than NMR are in the US. Given a large amount of your readers are Chinese, Indians and Koreans, what do you think its the best for us: stay in the States and compete with Americans or move back to home country which is isolated from the headquarter in the US or in the UK? Brian Trying to decide between Guggenheim and Lazard MM for IB summer analyst position Any thoughts? Ive been working during 3 years at MM boutique (Clearwater International) and now I have received 2 offers and I dont know which one to choose: i) one as senior analyst at BB (UBS) or ii) as M&A Director at a portco of a mid market PE fund, where the salary and bonus is below BB but theyd give me sweet equity, and being part of the board. How would you choose between generalist programme at Barclays HK VS ECM at BofA HK? Are they a quality EB? What are your thoughts on a place like Eastdil (real estate) vs RJ(IB)? -Unsure on future goals. Ex ut dolore et. Trying to better position myself since most of the larger PE shops did not look at analysts from my bank. What is the S.T.A.R. What can I do to prepare myself for work once I finished my undergraduate work? also curious your thoughts on some of the local (what I consider, EB), in UK / aus / CN / HK.. happy to provide a list. Probably not. I am curious about the overall quality of his team; is it proportionate with his reputation? Land investment banking offers with 578+ pages of detailed tutorials, templates and sample answers, quizzes, and 17 Excel-based case studies. http://dmi.thomsonreuters.com/Content/Files/2Q2015_MandA_MidMarket_FA_Review.pdf. How would you compare Houlihan Lokey Tech M&A in SF vs FT Partners in NYC for A1? I plan to eventually move into Private Equity and I would love your insight regarding this dilemma. Also, as you mentioned, the work is done in partnership with intrepid so it's split amongst a big team. Many of our deals are resolved in a court process you need to comfortable with that and able to have really hard line negotiations when theres a risk that everyone loses out. at least I didn't try to claim they were undisputed whilstcommenting on my own post using alts and then then subsequently forgetting to anon myself, Sounds like you made a good faith effort at arriving at informed/objective opinion (as much as an opinion can be "objective."). Also culture of group is top notch. Co-Head of Financing Advisory & Restructuring for North America New York T: +1 212 389 1539 E: neil.augustine@greenhill.com Mr. Augustine joined Greenhill in 2018. And you can transition to other firms later. Sorry, you need to login or sign up in order to vote. Would you say working in a restructuring group at a top MM bank (excluding HLHZ) places you in a better position at medium to larger sized funds? How do the exit opps from these firms compare to Wells Fargo or Jefferies? Your email address will not be published. Similarly, you have to be careful with Industry-Specific Boutiques (ISBs) and Regional Boutiques (RBs) if your main motivation is the exit opportunity. I have an offer with Rothschild and was wondering if anyone had further information on the group (sentiment, exits, reputation etc). FYI Im a recent grad (<1 year) from a decent albeit semi-target school and the role in OpCo is for TMT M&A. So unless you have a very specific reason for wanting one of the others, such as a specific connection or group at one of them, DB seems like the clear winner here. I think it's extremely naive actually and I don't like that perception at all. I dont have a strong view, but in the U.S. market, theyre lesser-known names and therefore not as good for exit opportunities. I'm interested in restructuring, so let's assume I'm placed into that group (more than likely). In general, Rothschild, Moelis, and Evercore are still probably your best bets because of their overall reputation. Also at a BB what does this title even mean /Vice Chairman, Head FIG Americas , Investment Banking/. Hey Brian! Finally, these firms are very small and tend to operate in only one city, or perhaps a few cities outside of major financial centers. 3.6 GPA from a semi-target with good analytical internship experience but not investment banking. Can I ask if brand name is more important than relevance for landing BB IB interviews? Hello! One offer from an In-Between-a-Banks (think ING, ABN, SocGen) and another from a very respected MM M&A boutique (think Baird, William Blair, HL). (Same location), Profile: Essentially, you are developing a very similar skill set to what PE desires, which would make your life, as the interviewee, easier. The primary impetus for a restructuring practice falling or rising in the league tables is, as you'd guess, managing directors coming and going. The BBs are actually really, really good still and shouldn't be talked down so much (so I am somewhat being defensive) as they are on this site. What would you do if you were in my shoes? Houlihan Lokey's Industrials Group has earned a reputation for providing superior service and achieving outstanding results in M&A advisory, capital-raising, restructuring, and financial and valuation advisory services. This site is such a wealth of information! Back then, restructuring was very active and I found it quite interesting and asked to be moved into the restructuring group full time.. Is it more of a corporate development role or a corporate finance role? Find thousands of job opportunities by signing up to eFinancialCareers today. Aut voluptas recusandae sed et quia esse. Or take the EB/BB internship right after the IB MM internship and see where it goes from there? Worked at a lower middle market boutique advisory firm last summer. Heard Guggenheim is top paying on the street and growing rapidly. You could also get great deal experience at Evercore, but if you are on the restructuring side I would argue that is a bit less certain. Already this year, it's added more than 20 analysts to help relieve the pressure on existing junior employees in Paris. Dont try to time the market because the process always takes more time than you think. Would you say they are on the same playing field as the Raine Group or LionTree? Hi Brian, in what category would you put Spanish Banks Santander and BBVA, In-Between-a-Banks (IBABs) or Middle-Market? Maiores assumenda odit vitae cupiditate consequuntur. Also is it correct to assume they are a bit more selective than middle markets but less selective than EB? Contact:sbutcher@efinancialcareers.com, Bear with us if you leave a comment at the bottom of this article: all our comments are moderated by human beings. (Heard that SAI is the best way for FT conversion) Merchant banks, for example, operate as combined private equity firms and investment banks, offering advisory services and also investing in companies. We spoke to Simon Lalande, an assistant director on Rothschild's debt advisory and restructuring team, about what his job involves. I dont really think there will be a huge difference between MS/GS LevFin and M&A at a top EB in terms of PE recruiting, but yes, M&A at the EB is still probably a safer bet just because you never know exactly what Leveraged Finance will entail. Potentially, yes, but there are serious concerns about DBs solvency at the moment. Bro this is getting so out of hand. Thanks in advance. The problem is, Does this 2nd internship (with a poor brand name) will ruin my shots to get into a summer in a BB? Thanks for the great article, very helpful for me as Im quite clueless. Honestly you should bump down Lazard for their comp, bump down gugg, mklein, etc and lump with the BBs then bump down ducera and greenhill (non rx). Of course you want to go to a good bank, but just know that people and culture is a huge factor in day to day life. My staff hasnt responded it yetdo you think I should walk into his office tomorrow and ask for more work? Hey Brian, Im going to my sophomore year in the fall and Im preparing for a summer IB analyst internship. Sorry to keep bothering you with these questions, but recruiting keeps changing. But you could ask the new bank about it as well. Rothschild's restructuring is known to be the strongest part of the US branch whereas Evercore has much more of an M&A history / pedigree. So far, there isn't any extra pay on offer at either bank. DCM Summer at IBAB or IB Summer at MM? Thanks so much for the reply! Hmm. The commentary is made forward looking, Rothschild RX has seen some big exits whereas Jefferies has added people from arguably one of the best RX groups (PJT RSSG and EVR RX). That funding usually comes from new equity or debt issuance., Ive got a few live deals at the moment. I have now 2 internship IB offers in continental Europe, both could potentially turn to full time offers. I would probably favor the MM bank for the reasons you mentioned. Its pretty rare to go from Big 4 middle-market M&A into private equity, for example (with obvious exceptions for some regions, teams, etc.). That is more like upper-middle-market territory. And WF or RBC would beat something like Piper Sandler. JT Marlin is about it for both, especially for BX. Overall, if I were a prospect considering offers (nothing else matters), below would be my general composite rankings. It would be almost impossible to get into mega-funds if youre coming from a MM bank. Eventually it will unless its offensive or libelous (in which case it wont. Have you ever heard of a firm called Lancaster Pollard? Yes, its generally better to start out in London, but who knows what will happen post-Brexit. Thanks! Similar to the bulge bracket banks, middle market banks also offer a variety of services and have a wide geographical presence, but they work on smaller deals. Yeah I would say it has more "prestige" than the NY office but I wouldn't say it significantly outclasses it although it is definitely the best office in LA and will get you looks anywhere Ive heard, Yeah but a bit lower simply because WF is on an upward trajectory. For something like Citi in London vs. MS in Paris, Id say Citi in London is still better for now. But if all your experience is tech-related, I dont think you have a great shot at IB roles since they want to see finance-related experience (Big 4, corporate finance, valuation, etc.) Finally, before you freak out and start wondering why I did not mention your bank, realize that it is impossible to mention every bank in the world. But bulge brackets are still better if you want to pursue other corporate roles outside of banking in the future. What recommendations do you have? Your GPA is fine, but being a transfer student and attending a non-target UC make it tough, especially with hyper-accelerated recruiting these days. So RBCs reputation may change, but it may not be soon enough for you to take advantage of it. Im in a bit of a conundrum that I was hoping you could help me with. Whats their reputation and how do they fare in terms of exit opps? The logic is that you could easily talk about developing the investor mindset as well as the enjoyment of working with companies in the long-term. My age is on the older side as well. Is there anyway I can try to switch my internship division at my bulge bracket from S&T to IB before next year (Summer 2023)? Do you have any advice on which to pick? They are significant vs. actual MM firms like Blair/Baird/HL. Yes, GS FIG is in a bit of a different category than other FIG teams, but there is still a chance of getting stuck there and not being able to recruit that well outside FIG. Raine (Media, like the hybrid model, more of a career move), 4. Voluptatum quo aut et ea nihil corporis. Would you suggest even trying for the BB banks? Hey Brian, what about merchant banks? Its possible that the rankings will change over time. No, I would not. Or should I just apply to the boutiques mainly? Im sure that some analysts at top merchant banks have won mega-fund or VC offers before, but its far less common if you look at peoples LinkedIn profiles, bios on company sites, etc. That sounds about normal. The standard answer is "any megafund you please. Healthcare/TMT, followed by infrastructure/utilities, followed by ECM. Theres some disagreement over the exact firms in this list, so Ive added question marks or notes after ones with uncertainty. HW is typically regarded as the #1 middle market bank, so that certainly helps as well. See the articles on compensation, the career path, etc. Industrials. Like Goldman Sachs, Lazard has also been ensuring that juniors have extended weekends like Easter off in theirentirety. Also, within a certain category, being a top bank doesnt make much of a difference its not as if exit opportunities become a lot more widely available just because a banks reputation within its category has improved. I dont really see many Asians make it to MD or above do you think its because of cultural and language barriers? Last thing; Considering the fact that I want to end up at MM PE (think Bridgepoint), do you think it is better for me to lateral to a BB/EB (JPM, BofA, Lazard, Jefferies) after 1-2 years at the IBAB/MM boutique? Sounds suspicious while I see the amount of turnover at the BBs & EBs. Being in NYC is better for exits/other opportunities, but youll probably have a better lifestyle at HL, or at least have a bit more free time to research other opportunities. Its not as structured in Europe (and maybe some smaller markets in the U.S.). 3.8 GPA. Does being at RB long term (like really no name) hurt your chances for b-school? You get the best of both worlds: name brand and skill set. This isn't the only option on the table, but I'm hoping to get more information on this group specifically, instead of hearing age-old arguments surrounding whatever other opportunities I happen to list. Photo credit:Need help to build? Hence, if I stay with my current firm, I wont be able to change for another bank until October next yearIf I start looking for opportunities at other banks, I may join the firm right before the visa process and I am not even sure whether I will get the visa in April (its a lottery process). My understanding was that they were considered an eb/ that their restructuring group is a top 3 player in the space. We are deleting 80-90% of the content on the site (200 articles are already gone) because a lot of it is out of date or not that useful, and the UBS LA article fell into that category. Can you lateral to a BB or MM as a VP after being a VP there? Okay, great point. The MBA should be your last resort because its expensive and time-consuming and probably not necessary. Others are in the middle. VP) outside the US. Analyst / Associate - Leveraged Finance Debt Advisory, Investment Banking M&A Generalist - Senior Analyst Position, "Andrea Orcel is an excellent banker but his pay rise is extreme".