I did get on the FiT in the early days for the 66cpkWh, but installed a separate system (which I have since incorporated into my stand-alone system. In my case, I have N & W facing panels, My inverters clip to 5Kw for a few hours, but I can still export a reasonable amount. I want about 10Kw of panels so I can run pumps etc. But you probably would not recover the cost of the battery within its lifetime. But, if you are living in an area where it is required to install a large solar system a situation around half of Australians are in then export limiting can allow a larger system with normally very minor losses of clean solar generation. Though endless quibbling over unnecessary details might keep the presses churning, a FACT remains that Ive been using ever-more-cost-effective batteries since 1980. But this is at least partially because when you throttle back output, you also reduce the amount of voltage rise you are causing on your local connection to the point of interconnect which is probably contributing to the issue. This is because even if there is only a refrigerator running during the day it will reduce the losses from export limiting and if an effort is made to shift electricity consumption to the middle of the day then losses can be mostly or entirely eliminated. Metered and a non metered version. Why my Power Limit is set to ON with the % whereas her Power Limit is set to OFF and she has been exporting. The following is a list of the areas in case youve been missed. If you are export limited, the only way to implement that is with some sort of meter as Ronald says. Some say so you want to replace your system? This could be important, given that we have a state parliamentary election due in a couple of months. I have 3 x PV systems on one phase. For example, I can see several Energex profiles that do things like limit export to differing amounts, turns on Volt-var without Volt-watt, or sets the power factor to 0.9. The installer has been able to get the system through WP in the past as the inverter can limit the export to grid to 3kva. And also is it worth installing solar with 0 kWh limit with self consumption around 20-30%( payback 6-7 years). Where do I find information on reapplying for export with Powercor? This profile also doesnt impose any export limits, because Endeavour Energy didnt require them of my installation (maximum is 30kW for a 3-phase installation, which my one is well under). Assume positive intention.4. Okay, so that heading may be a bit of an exaggeration, but improvements the company has carried out appear to have made quite a difference. I am not even sure the inverter would support that, but I fear that sadly up to 25% of the PV energy might be going to waste! I have spoken to one installer , but he couldnt really help me . Why on earth would I do that if I can help it. I was told to set Power Limit to ON. Powercor will respond in one of three ways: Approve the size system you've requested Limit the amount of power you can export to the grid (e.g. On a related note, we mentioned yesterday that over the border in South Australia, SA Power Networks is readying to ramp up flexible solar exports in an effort to support more solar installations and its pretty clever stuff. So-called wasting of the extra electricity produced is irrelevant: sunlight is FREE, and whether I use it or not has no bearing on the environment. Is there anything that can be done about it? March 2022 6 Powercor means Powercor Australia Limited, ABN 89 064 651 109. portal means the eConnect portal for CitiPower and . If we consider a home in Sydney where no electricity is used during the day, and all the solar panels face directly north, then the percentage of output that will be lost due to a 5 kilowatt export limit would be: So even in a worst-case situation for Sydney, an 8 kilowatt solar system that is exported limited to 5 kilowatts will only lose 4% of generation. Energex doesnt automatically allow inverters over 5 kilowatts to be installed with export limiting, but currently regularly grants permission for single-phase homes on the main grid to install up to 10 kilowatts of inverter capacity with export limiting. The fact that export limiting is necessary is not a good thing. So, I am pretty much left in the dark about whether all the energy my panels are theoretically producing is being utilised, or (which is my fearful assumption) up to 1.6kW are wasted whenever the panels produce more than 5kW AC. Whilst this may not be technically defined as export limiting, as the inverter specifications, specify that the inverter, whilst allowing up to an overload factor of 2, will only generate up to 5kW of A/C power Hi Everyone, ARTICLE WRITES: Queenslands Energex area: South East Queensland. Victorias Jemena network area: A small but crowded chunk of North and Western Melbourne. Enter your postcode now. 0000093063 00000 n Self confessed newbie to the mechanics of Solar so bear with me. Website link shows system producing well over 10 kW. Great article and content on this website 0000038218 00000 n 5kW times the number of hours is the total production over that time. To me it does not quite make sense as no system can produce 100% of its capacity meaning my existing 3.5kW will never produce full 3.5kW (on a good day, I am lucky to get 2.5kW). I can also see specific profiles for other grid networks, such as Ausgrid and Ergon, that likely have specific requirements of the inverters. The new inverter standard AS/NZS 4777.2:2020 has new inclusions to address grid stability issues - a new feature that is necessary to further enhance the hosting capacity to accommodate more solar and renewable energy systems. 3. 4. Below is the email response I received from Powercor. At times MPPT1 is at 600 odd watts while MPPT2 is at 2500 odd watts. My sister has the same type of inverter (Goodwe) but she lives in the Estern suburbs of Victoria and she has been exporting but her Power Limit was set OFF. 20% Even if you have the Envoy-S, I believe at least on paper there was a Enphase Envoy-S Some networks will allow larger sizes than those outlined below, pending specific approval from the network. ) I dont quite understand how the DC energy from the inverter can go to my home circuits first, before any excess current is fed into the grid. The word first can be confusing. An option is to take your pumps off-grid and run them independently off a separate off-grid solar system. 0000037497 00000 n both said There are lots of variations to this theme, however. you request 5kW and Powercor says you can only export 2.5kW) Set a 'zero export' limit - i.e. Surely the distributors capping what you can export to the grid is a bad thing? If thats not a good option, you can consider getting a demand tariff and doing pumping outside the peak period when the cost of grid electricity will be relatively low. <]/Prev 115522/XRefStm 1575>> I am on my second Tesla EV and the new one has a rage of 700km if youre not a lead foot. 0000028638 00000 n Victorias Powercor area: Western Victoria, including a large portion of West Melbourne. Nobody wants to see solar energy . They did say that with future upgrades we could reapply, but I cant find a way to do this. 3. trailer Even if I were exporting 100% of it, it still would only bring down my bills by a tiny amount per month. They want to do it there way and it seems my request complicates things for them and I dont hear back, bar a couple. In most cases, if you had your envoy shut off, the micros would start and work on their own and independently of the envoy, and in fact of each other. We have a 3kwh system and are really using as much during the day as we can. South Australian solar panel owners can currently export 5 kilowatts of electricity to the grid but under Flexible Exports, they could export double that amount 10kW. The daily export limit is averaged across your billing period (calculated by multiplying the number of days in your billing period by your daily export limit of 14 kWh). 0000029403 00000 n Real names are preferred - you should be happy to put your name to your comments.2. They hid the problem pretty well, because they do tend to reduce the amount of shutdowns. 0000037952 00000 n Most systems have mostly N facing panels, so really only generate peak power for a few hours a day (often 10am>2pm approx) Very true AL0126. (2nd one APPROVAL/SITE SPECIFIC CONDITION(s): Total Solar Export must be limited to 5kW). Powercor wrote back with the following response:"Due to the size of t . The loss figures above are for Sydney and are affected by the climate. What made the situation all the more frustrating is periods of high congestion which can threaten the stability of a local network can be quite brief. A man named Canute, proved that, centuries ago. I am afraid Western Power is very strict. We installed 4.5kw with a 5kw inverter in 2014. 0000038830 00000 n VAr (var % rated VA) But given average voltages are probably well above what they should be in lots of places, and once you factor in your local voltage rise, and pretty low values under AS4777 etc, there is not much room to play with until the distributors get the act together and deliver us power that better matches the 230v standard they are required to deliver us. Thanks Ronald! Its also unusual for a large solar system to have all the panels facing the same direction. A Decent Battery From sonnen. I believe it must have been set up during installation, but the installer company claims that this is handled by Growatt themselves. Or is the energy produced by the panels but dissipated somehow? Please stay on topic. hbbf`b``3 I j I am surprised to hear that Powercor has allowed you to increase your exports, but that is good to hear. Nominal Output Power (W) 5000 This extra meter adds to the cost of a solar system. 0000011077 00000 n And, if a street full of these, plugs their cars into the grid, for recharging, starting the recharging between 1700 and 1800, lots of entertaining fireworks, along the street powerlines exploding. 0000029011 00000 n Economically this probably Is not viable, as our electricity bill is fairly low. It can also only provide this when it is running. I have previously posted (or, submitted for posting), the proposition that what is needed, is a hybrid (not meaning in this instance, a hybrid inverter as is commonly used) inverter that is like a cross/combination, of the Goodwe GW5000-MS inverter (or, kind of, the GW10K-MS, in terms of power conversion), and the Goodwe GW5048D-ES; three GW5000-MS provides for up to 10kW of panels generating capacity, across three MPPTs (strings? On the main grid, single-phase properties can have 5 kilowatts of solar inverter capacity, and three-phase properties can have 15 kilowatts. Would the gateway signal the micro inverters to shut down one at a time, or to all reduce output equally? 240 207 A 5 kilowatt inverter will never supply more than 5 kilowatts of power no matter how many kilowatts of panels it has. 0000000016 00000 n Rooftop solar works by turning sunlight into electric power. hb```f``sd`c`edd@ A >hp`86s8::\ MNmOe0pYuR`i g G7@ $n@]A#&S_2.dx f When it says that you can export 5kw, does that mean you can export up to 5kw PER HOUR? 100% No matter how badly you may want to export limit your solar system, it can only be done in locations where its permitted. Have I been conned into believing I could produce up to 6.6kW myself, but in fact the maximum my inverter will ever allow through to the meter (and to my house) is only 5kW? As a single example, the Renault Kangoo ZE van (I think that it is the only battery powered cargo van currently available in Australia) has a 33kWh battery, and, To go further, Kangoo Z.E boasts a Z.E 33 (33kWh) battery, P/Prated (%) Thanks so much, David. Sorry if dumb question. And yes 5kW export limit applies May I suggest an extra fact check to polish the valuable story above? It would definitely be better if we didnt need to limit the amount of power solar systems sent into the grid. I have seen my panels producing over 13 kW of power when the battery is drawing 3 kW DC power and the battery, house and car 10 kW of AC power. Real names are preferred - you should be happy to put your name to your comments.2. Larger inverters that are export limited are allowed on a case by case basis. Furthermore, the sustained overvoltage inverter protection set point shall be set to 258V. South Australia Power Networks (SAPN) area: SAPN is the only distributor in South Australia. In a Enphase system, only the Envoy can provide this. Please make sure you engage early with our team through eConnect to check on network capacity for your customers. What inverter do you have? Reminder: In Australia, you are allowed to install 33% more panel capacity than the inverter capacity for example, a 10 kW inverter can have up to 13.33 kW of panels attached. NSWs Endeavour Energy area: Western Sydney. Victorias United Energy Network Area: A large chunk of Melbourne on the east side Port Phillip Bay and the Bayside Peninsula. More information about the program and how customers can get the most out of their rooftop solar is available at www.powercor.com.au/solar-energy Is this correct? Normally single phase properties can have up to 5 kilowatts of solar inverter capacity and 3 phase properties can have 15 kilowatts. We are on a zero limited export. 0000004622 00000 n While the Envoy is an important part of the system, the micros largely operate independently of the Envoy, and in a lot of cases can work without the Envoy at all. But it took him about another ten years to focus on it in a way that wasnt really stupid, Good Article. See image at http://www.johnrogers.com.au/battery_charging_noon.jpg, CORRECTION: My 13.25 kW system will not go above the 10 kW inverter limit unless my house battery is charging and then it can go to 13.25 kW. Long term benefits would be a more energy efficient system. I was lucky to have an early approval, so limited to 10Kw (or due to bad calculation by the approver, 8.6Kw, where he said ALL the Neutral current went down the common Neutral wire, where in fact only the difference between the phases goes down the Neutral (2 phase, 180 degree). Rubbing salt into the wound were situations where someone was zero export limited while their next door neighbour wasnt. If they face in two or more directions, it will further reduce the losses by reducing the peak solar output while stretching it out, so it lasts longer through the day. There may well be a tipping point in battery prices where a drought of mid day solar will be followed by very little evening use and possibly large numbers of households abandoning the grid altogether. So the size of the system becomes irrelevant if you can only export 3kwh (we are Regional NSW Essential Energy). Now, there are quite a few profiles on offer that can be programmed into the microinverters. I cant justify the cost of adding additional solar if the max I can export with Essential energy is 3kwh. 0000006578 00000 n I think of it like the rate at which water is flowing out of a hose. Will this mean any additional system would be limited to 0kW output?? Ill upgrade the Endeavour Energy area from Ugly to Bad, since things are clearly not all bad there. just wondering if anybody can shed some light on the following, This certainly goes well beyond initial configuration and reporting. Im surprised this hasnt hit the mainstream media yet. While export limiting is possible its not always approved. Its moderately cheaper and the solar feed-in tariff youll receive will lower your electricity bills and increase the amount of clean energy available for others to use. Put down your weapons.3. But there is also the DNSP rules which need to be followed. So, if a contractor or tradesman, using one of these during the day, or, another type of worker, gets home after work, and, plugs one of these in to charge, an immediate drain of 7 kW (I believe that it is actually 7.4 kW), and immediate significant drain is imposed on the grid, for several hours, during peak demand. As such, unless the investment pays for itself within at most 5-6 years, IMHO it is not a good investment/waste of money and natural resources. 0000038484 00000 n There are two options: 1. Swearing revenge, he began his lifelong quest to reduce the harm the environment could cause. But just note, not everyone Envoy has required bits to do export limiting. To add to this, in the installer section of the Envoys web server control panel, you can set the profile by which all microinverters operate. About CitiPower and Powercor FACT SHEET: SOLAR EXPORT APPROVAL Set appliances to use your solar power Maintenance and safety checks are important It is critical that you install an approved smart inverter and set it correctly. According to NT Power and Water they will normally allow up to a 5 kilowatt inverter with single phase power and up to a 7 kilowatt inverter with 3 phase power. This means you tend to see panels at the end of strings shutdown soonest on voltage risk conditions, as they have the highest voltage rise being at the end of the string. We want to add a battery and it seems logical to add more cells also to another inverter/battery setup. So my understanding of the info above is that my inverter will increase production in unison with demand until it hits 5kw? Powercor says it has contacted all solar customers within the previously impacted areas to let them know about the companys progress and to encourage them to consider reapplying for exports. Its the same with kW and hours of solar electricity production. If you are interested you can read about this here: https://www.solarquotes.com.au/inverters/mppt/. driving range of 200km depending on ambient temperature. There are exceptions for off-grid installations and systems that are installed with a battery. Im on a swer line in rural south Australia. Powercor's network solutions manager Claire Cass said of 32,580 customers connected to solar with Powercor in the last 18 months, only 2023 could not export power. People have done it at fairly low cost with second hand panels and a DC pump.) If you are in the solar industry - try to get to the truth, not the sale.5. Solar export limiting, or 'export limiting', occurs most often when there is more power being pushed into the grid than it can handle. Now, such a hybrid inverter, as I previously submitted as a post, as being needed, would have the capability of providing for up to 10kW of panels generating capacity, and, of power conversion of up to 10kW, to provide for up to 5kW to provide for charging a battery system, and, the other 5kW to provide for the household load and with surplus (to the household load, out of the 5kW provision) being exported to the grid. %PDF-1.4 % Efficiency has and will improve further over time, but never to the point of perpetuity. I live in Warrnambool, Victoria. If you use a pre AS4777.3:2005 the limits are probably even higher, but you loose some other features (like frequency ramping which is probably very sensible to have if you want to be a good grid citizen), and you probably are not supposed to run those unless it is a pre 2016 install. It also allows you to focus on increasing your self consumption which in turn provides a better return on investment. STCs can be received for panel capacity up to one-third greater than the inverter capacity. Note that connections off the main grid are usually far more restricted. However they have been advised that this wont be allowed anymore. The whole system of domestic rooftop photovoltaic systems, needs to be reviewed; by both the legislatures and regulators, and, by the components (especially the inverters) manufacturers. The current Envoy they will be selling is the Envoy-S. Before that was the straight Envoy which did not have the consumption monitoring / metering needed to do export limiting. The 7kW charger achieves full charge in 6 hours, and one So really apart from the requirement that the initial startup can only happy on voltages below 253v, I have no throttling until at least 285v and probably even higher. sonnenBatterie Evo. After a major works program involving more than 500 different network alterations and other activities across nine key regions among the most constrained parts of the network, Powercors new solar connections export approval rate of just over 60% at the start of the year has increased to above 90%. An Update: I just had system installed 4 days ago in the Energex DNSP and suggest the above is perhaps not quite correct. If your pumping needs are large enough this can pay for itself, but it will be expensive to set up. Its only possible to go larger with a zero export limit: https://www.powerwater.com.au/customers/power/solar-power-systems/pv-class-requirements. The installation of solar photovoltaic systems as well as the correct inverter settings are critical to ensuring customers get the most for their investment in this technology. It is possible to max out the 10 kW inverter capacity with my Tesla, house load and Heat Pump hot water. Select your country/region. But still the solar companies keep trying to sell it to me.. 0000027818 00000 n It is just the placement of the meter and the current sensor that controls the limiting. Normally it makes more sense to buy a second, separate system, than to expand an existing one. essential enrgy in central west nsw (Orange) are generally restricting to max 5kw export limit regardless of 1ph or 3ph: 2 x 3ph residential applications approvals cutnpaste below only difference was one specifically stated APPROVAL/SITE SPECIFIC CONDITION(s): Total Site to be export limited to 5kW 3 phase 1.66kW/per phase (and the padmount sub for the subdivision in on the property boundary) So an Enphase setup, without a continuously operating Envoy with not be providing this functionality and likely to raise some concerns in the AS4777.2015 certification process if they did not take steps to make sure these functions are always guaranteed to be implemented. With permission export limiting can be used to install larger systems. I still dont know if they have programmed the inverter to reduce the overall output by a percentage or not. Hi All, There is not likely to be an Enphase system without a gateway (called the Envoy with in the Enphase system), because this is needed to setup the system, configure its profiles and report production and other important functions of the system. I think the installers like the Volt-watt modes, because if you dont know where to look they hid the problem at your expense anyway. Thanks for the information. Please keep the SolarQuotes blog constructive and useful with these 5 rules: 1. Recent work by Victorian DNSP Powercor on some problematic parts of its network is enabling more solar power from rooftop panels to be exported to the grid. Export limiting generally isnt permitted. It seems so strange that it is clear government policy to get more solar going and yet the network operators are effectively blocking it now. I have solar on my house and having it installed at an investment property, but not sure what to do now as there will be no benefit of feed in tariff.